Failed experiment?
The sudden departure of Experi-Mental Café’s main man leaves local musicians with mixed feelings
By Steven Booth 05/29/2008
The local music scene has erupted in controversy, as Oxnard’s Experi-Mental Café, one of the area’s few remaining live music venues, has recently gone through an ownership change that has the previous owner threatening legal action, the new owners feeling a bit defensive, and most musicians feeling caught in the middle.
Peter Bouloukos, whose vision turned the café into not only one of the premier music spots in Ventura County, but also one of the area’s last regular all-ages venues, left with little notice, while new owner Jayce Martin, a local musician, took over amid the fallout from Bouloukos’ departure. An Internet-based war of words ensued, with bands refusing to show up for scheduled gigs at the café and many of those involved choosing sides — or choosing not to.
The Experi-Mental Café was founded in 2007 by Bouloukos along with the owners of the Woolworth Building in Downtown Oxnard.
Fresh from success with other club and booking ventures, Bouloukos took over the site of the old diner area and turned it into a place falling somewhere between a hip 21st century coffeehouse, a 1960s-era diner and a museum of post-World War II America.
He began to book bands of all stripes in weekly showcases such as Wide Open Wednesdays and Fat-Tire Fridays, created a big buzz around town and attracted a growing audience. Bouloukos was known not only for his booking of eclectic musicians, but also for his caring treatment of the bands he booked.
“Pete is pretty rare,” says Ryan Galvan, keyboardist and songwriter for Ventura-based band Afterward. “He’s an exceptional man. He’s not a typical Ventura County bar or restaurant manager. It’s exceptional what he’s done for the music scene around here.”
Describing the crowd at the café, Galvan says, “It’s not like your typical club. The audience is people who really want to enjoy music and see something different.”
Bouloukos did not return requests for comment, but he did e-mail a statement regarding his ouster. “This absolutely blindsided me,” he wrote. “I want everyone to know how hard I worked to bring all of us together, and it was my intention to build goodwill for all. The Woolworth Building Inc. have been very dishonest with all of us with regard to intention, commitment, and heart. That is all I can say. I appreciate your support.
“Do not support any efforts by the new owner to book music in Ventura County,” he added.
Bouloukos wrote that he would be working hard to find a replacement venue to support the remaining shows he had booked.
None of this has made it easy for the new owner. Martyn, a local musician and restaurateur who bought the café from the building owners, has found himself in a tug-of-war with Bouloukos over band bookings and said business has suffered due to bands not showing up to scheduled performances and the negative word-of-mouth.
“What Pete is doing is not ethical,” he says.
“This is an issue he needs to take up with David and Nancy [Feigin, the owners of the building]. Pete had an opportunity to buy the business, and he didn’t.”
Martyn insists that beyond adding a Cajun flair to the menu and perhaps a larger dose of blues and jazz, he has no intention of altering the focus on music or the funky ambiance of the café. If anything, he says he wants to increase the musical focus.
“I want to increase the flow of customers and make this the happening spot in Ventura for live bands,” he says. “Right now people in Oxnard have to go to Ventura, Santa Barbara or Los Angeles to hear live music. I want to change that.”
The local musicians are trapped in a difficult position, between Bouloukos — a known advocate for local bands — and the café now owned by someone they are not familiar with but which still presents an inviting place to play.
Singer-songwriter Judy Valencerina, who with Bouloukos got the popular Wide Open Wednesdays going at the café and handled much of the booking, has mixed feelings about the ownership change, feeling bad for her friend Bouloukos but also appreciating the opportunity of what is still a fine venue.
“I really feel caught in the middle,” she says.
“I don’t like the way [Bouloukos] handled things so publicly. It became such a personal thing.”
Mixed feelings aside, she remains committed to Wide Open Wednesdays at the café.
“The venue is important to me and the other musicians, and we want everyone to come out and support the café,” she says.
Other musicians are similarly conflicted. Galvan, who has been deeply involved with the café, wishes to reserve comment until he meets Martyn. Chris Perez, a member of I Was A Lover, Delorean Was A Dealer, summed up the situation for many.
“Pete pretty much was the Experi-Mental Café,” he says, adding, “I don’t really have a side. I’ll support Pete and still go to the café. I would play there.”
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It shouldn't be so easy to take sides regarding this issue, in my humble opinion. The bottom line is, none of us have all the facts we need to make up our minds. Yes, Pete was passionate about what he did, and I'm sure he was a really good person. But we're talking about a business here - and things may not be so clear cut. I assume there are money issues on Pete's side...and I assume that there are unknown issues on Jace's side. The music scene does NOT have to take a hit, Bass101, as you've mentioned. The cafe is still open for business, and they are carrying on with live music every day of the week, if you look into it. Pete is bringing acts to more venues, so that is also a plus. Like any difficult situation, it is what you make of it.
As for the way people were acting on the internet - I think that certain privileges were taken advantage of, and I still do not think it is fair to the musicians who aren't able to voice their opinions without all facts.
Peter Bouloukos entered an agreement with David Feigin in April of 2007 to manage what was known as “The Woolworth Building Deli & Lunch Counter.”
I know from speaking to Peter last October that David had offered him the business and Peter had accepted under very friendly terms. I also know that prior to that time David had not been part of the daily operations and very rarely if ever would stop in to support the efforts of the Deli. If I recall the restaurant was losing a lot of money under David’s “rule” and nobody had really heard of The Woolworth Building, a deli or an Experi-mental Café.
Peter took over on November 1, 2007. He did not have a corporation yet. He and his girlfriend supported the café with personal assets while they rushed to incorporate. David Feigin is in Real Estate you guys! He not only solved a leak in his personal cash flow by making a deal with Peter, he probably knew Peter would succeed boosting the value of the building and his Deli.
Peter began to advertise and spend money improving the quality of offerings. He created the very “scene” this article speaks of by bringing music from all over the world through our county.
Peter said that he if he were an investor looking at The Woolworth Building Deli losing thousands upon thousands of dollars each month in Downtown Oxnard he would not buy it. He would wait for it to go out of business and make an asset purchase for the equipment and take it to a different location with more visibility, credibility, and goodwill.
This is where Peter’s heart steps in.
Peter made a purchase deal with David in November with no rent and a friendly deal to first generate profit prior to negotiating a manageable rent scale. I remember this because at that time it showed David Feigin to be a person who wanted to do something great for downtown Oxnard. From what we all know now, Peter was the person to take on ownership and direction of The Woolworth Building Deli & Lunch Counter. Peter could have walked away in late October but he believed in the word and commitment David gave him. “Experi-Pete” not “Experi-David” was created.
The Experi-mental Café was born. Very few of you know what that support has cost Peter and his family. By the way, when Peter speaks of family it includes each and every one of you.
On Tuesday, Peter said one thing to me with regard to music…he was clear in support of anyone who is passionate about what they do as long as they do so “with great heart, energy and above all integrity.” The term integrity comes out of his mouth a lot!
He also mentioned that he absolutely did not know that David Feigin had sold The Experi-mental Café where he had been told he had a right of first refusal and intended to make the purchase deal final this summer. David told the Oxnard Police officers that Peter was his employee and that he owned the Café not Peter. Peter was forcefully removed in-front of his family members and staff. David then sold the café and withheld money owed to Peter, his corporation and staff. If you purchased food and beverage from the Café this past week you consumed goods bought by Peter and his restaurant group…not by David or any new owner. That my friends is against Federal law.
If you do not know of David Feigin you should know this, that he is someone Peter really believed in. Peter thought of him as a mentor and trusted this mans word in good faith. A lot of you do not now what that means to a father of two who also took in another family this Spring. You have no idea.
It was Peter’s corporation, his money, time and expertise that provided a buzz for music. Some of you do not understand what integrity means, but let me tell you that the very heart, soul and energy you felt at The Experi-mental Café was within Peter and he was teaching us all a lot.
You also should know that Peter does not want you to take sides.
Peter has an issue with the owner of the building that profits by having the café in operation. David profits by the sale of a café he did not build or even totally own. He sold a good name from under Peter who would have opened more than a few Experi-mental Café’s perhaps in your neighborhood next. He used Peter’s good heart, money and I would say took a piece of OUR soul with this sale.
I have more information to follow.
Four walls and a stage in a window do not make a music scene or a specific location a venue. If any of you have been on tour you know that Heart, Passion and Integrity make a scene. I know that Peter voiced this language a lot. Do you know what it means?
I hope some of you and or all of you will adopt this cause FOR THE MUSIC SCENE and FOR DOING THE RIGHT THINGS. Let's help Peter. Let us also not turn our backs on the new owner of the cafe. That poor guy does not know the truth either.
I don’t know about all of you but I totally support Peter. I totally support live music. I also feel sorry that the new owner of The Experi-mental Café had certain topics misrepresented by The Woolworth Building Inc. To often the big man takes advantage of the little man. This is one prime example. It seems more than Pete has been misguided...all of us have.
You are right in saying four walls and a stage do not create the venue. But I think it's honestly silly to say that one man alone created the cafe. I've been going to the cafe for a few months now - mostly in the evenings for music... and I rarely saw Pete there. He may have a connection with some of these musicians through booking, but I'm an early bird - and many of these bands came into the venue without anyone to greet them. What kind of relationship is that with the music scene? And when I did see Pete, he was usually having a beer or two with friends. Which is fine - but that is all I know about Pete - and Dobbs, you seem very informative... but I would still like an explanation from the building owners. Two sides to every story.The truth is - it is not just Pete. The girls behind the counter and the girl on Wednesday and many many people put their heart and soul into it. This article is definitely leaning towards Pete's side, and I believe this is unfair to the new owners.
I think that is the very point, it should not lean anwhere. Support music. You know that Peter has a family at home and other responsibilities as an owner to attend to. You also know that Peter was often at the Cafe early while you were probably still out for the night. I would also offer that Peter created the menu and the very foundation that supported the staff and all musicians. If anyone knows anything about the restaurant industry they will agree that this foundation takes countless hours to create including experience and energy. So the "not seeing Peter" theory is a wrong direction to go because that is not fair. It is not human or even right to expect any one person to do every single job task. Peter did extend a lot of trust out to you "WhirledPeas" and everyone of us. I mentioned integrity. Last night. That is the foundation for all good things. Integrity does not mean control. Often, people of great integrity let go and empower others to be creative and do good work. Think about that. I also know Peter loves to have a cold beer and meet new people when he can. I also know he is a quiet person who likes to sit back and watch the things that he creates breath and grow. I hope that makes sense. I will call Pete and see if he will post something. I do not know much else to say! I just know that my dealings with Peter have been nothing but inspiring, friendly and fun. That in part is why I say that "Peter was teaching all of us alot" in his own way. Think about the Four Walls again. It's a powerful metaphor. I am sure the new person at the Cafe will do fine with his new ideas and experience. I am going to Mai's to catch a show on Tuesday. I might also check out the Cafe in Oxnard for Judy on Wednesday. I too have a family to take care of so I can not make it out at night to check out every band I would like to.
I do not want to go into who is right or wrong in this situation, as there has to be so much more to this story then what was published. I do not think that music in Ventura County will suffer because of this situation. As someone already pointed out, Peter is booking at other venues, which is actually increasing the opportunities for musicians and music-lovers in this area. As a longtime resident of Ventura County, I was never aware of the live music available within the county, until I was introduced to the Experi-mental Café last November. Since then, I have frequented various local venues (including Mai’s, Billy O’s, Zoey’s Café and even the Beachcomber) and have discovered that each venue has its own vibe. This vibe does not come from the walls that contain the venue but rather the people who are there as owners, managers, employees, musicians, and guests. I have found that the people who create this vibe are usually an extension of the owners and managers, as a place can only be as strong as those who run it. With this in mind, I do not know how the Experi-mental Café can survive as the place we have all grown to love with a vibe where “good people are always welcome”, if the people currently in charge have not acted in that manner. Given the situation where Peter was forcibly removed without any notice while new ownership was already place, I question the integrity of those currently in charge. How can someone continue to promote a vibe where “good people are always welcome” when they were instrumental in the removal of several “good people”? Just some thoughts to think about as you create your own opinion.
To all good people!
“No horse gets anywhere until it is harnessed. No steam or gas ever drives anything until it is confined. No Niagra is ever turned to light and power until it is tunneled. No life ever grows great until it is focused, dedicated, disciplined.”–Henry Emerson Fosdick.
Win-lose thinking is the underlying assumption of almost all negotiations. This comes from human nature with a mind-set of scarcity rather than abundance. The more the other guy wins or gets, the less there is for me. The goal is to get what you want. People who lack integrity will manipulate or jockey to gain advantage over the other guy to get him to concede as much as possible. With this mind-set both parties are forced to battle until one concedes or they settle on a compromise.
Me? I think of everyone as one. I see the world as a "whole." You are my brothers and sisters. You are my friends. I am very genuine in support and service of all good people. I also do the right things, at the right times for the right reasons...for the better good.
The Woolworth Building Inc. could have avoided all of this by simply being more courageous, honest and open with its tenant “The Woolworth Building Deli & Experi-mental Restaurants.” In good faith this tenant built a business that had no harness, steam, gas, Niagra or any growth plan in October of 2007. David Feigin referred to himself as an big slow care driving 50 miles an hour in the fast line and to me as a Corvette with a big engine ready to get going. David said that he was slowing me down and that due to family illness and stress outside of his control he did not want to have the café anymore. They explained to me that they wanted to become landlords. That has been pretty much most of what they have known for the better part of the 1980’s, 1990’s and today. The business was losing $9000 a month and more with David Feigin as owner.
At this time David made me multiple offers. I refused a few of them. I could not purchase a café in an area with no foot traffic or reputation for $100,000 when it was losing almost $10,000 per month. I estimated the physical assets to only be worth $22,000 and even those assets needed to be ripped out in part due to the poor planning done by Mr. Feigin and his associates. I moved here in good faith to work for Mr. Feigin. I took a lot of convincing on his part to get me to give up my salary and take over full control of The Woolworth Building Deli as David referred to it. I had always called it The Experi-mental Café. I Peter Bouloukos took over ownership of the Café located at 401 South A Street Suite 1, Oxnard, California 93030 in Ventura County on November 1, 2007. We agreed to operate and build the business without putting any money down. David knew it was a losing situation and it relieved him of the $10,000 a month leak in his “Niagra.”
I want everyone to know what I believe to be truth. I also did not dream up any sense of a split between artists. Yes, I do a great deal of work behind the scenes. As a leader I also do my best to build trust, capability and integrity. I never want to control anyone. I never want anyone to think they are not capable of handling a problem with their own inherent set of skills. I am always a few steps away ready to support anyone who values the same things I do.
I will continue to support all bands, artists and singer-songwriters. I will also support the new owner of The Experi-mental Café. I did not know that they had a new owner in place until late Sunday Night May 25th. David misrepresented his intentions to sell the business on May 23rd to both my corporation “The Woolworth Building Deli & Experi-mental Restaurants” Inc. and the Oxnard Police Department Supervisor who was not exactly sure what to do. I walked away in good faith that the courts will handle the rest. I also had so many written commitments as owner of The Experi-mental Café and “Experi-mental Restaurants Inc” that I had to do my best to honor at another venue. I have both tangeable and intangeable assets being misrepresented by David’s corporations to a new third party owner.
I have opened two themed restaurant concepts with my own money. I liked the idea of an Experi-mental Café but it needed so much love and energy that David admittedly could not provide it. In November I said that my café was “alive.” Now you all seem to think that it magically has a life. That is marketing, vision and hard work. That is a well thought out plan to bring a lot of great people together. No matter what anyone might believe about four walls and a stage…the bottom line is that my money and experience built a business that David and Nancy took for about two hours and then sold to a third party.
I was preparing for an incredible summer for all of us. I was also planning to finalize this purchase deal and was never offered my right to first refusal.
With all of this I want you to know that GOOD PEOPLE ARE ALWAYS WELCOME in my life. I have to figure out how to feed my family now. What is more upsetting than the stress of being a single father of two daughters with no real job...is that David and Nancy are wealthy and this action places two people I trusted and truly loved in such a bad light. I know this is all a lot to offer on-line but I am honest and have only pure intentions of truth here.
I am a good friend of Pete and his children. The one trait that i admire of Pete is his strong feelings of strong morals that he teaches all of us. What happened to him was out of his control. Pete is a man whos' only downfall is that he puts his faith and good will into people, and he expects that back. Pete was not shown a reflection of his morals back in this instance. Infact, he was shown the complete opposite of everything that he believes and teaches. If you know Pete even a little or through his "voice" found in marketing and the people he trains, he shares a passion and serious care for everyone involved with him and his journey to create something larger than himself and ventura county, a music scene that will give ANY band the oppurtunity to play and get there music out. Please support all of Pete's shows so we can make every band heard.
Although I have no desire to jump into the middle of a contract / real estate dispute I do feel i need to speak up for a man who has become a friend and a public asset. I first met Pete while i was helping book a friends band who was coming from out of state. I've dabbled in this work on for years and have dealt with all types of people. Generally the people you meet were all about the bottom line. How much can they make, and is there a local audience . Pete was the opposite. His first question was "are they talented?" and his second question was an exited "how can I make sure people hear this?". Pete always looks for the best in people and then tries to spread that good feeling to others.
Pete never once thought he'd make a killing at his little cafe in downtown Oxnard. But he always dreamed of something bigger. He single handedly built a safe, fun and accepting music scene in a town that every one else writes off. Unfortunately Pete's quixotic dreams came crashing down when he was suddenly removed from the cafe that for 6 months he had put every hour, every penny, and every piece of his heart into.
Pete never wanted this to be a public fight and he has no desires to split the local music scene. He's already booking shows for other venues and pursuing all his other options. I think he's still chasing at windmills and I think were all better for it.
Sounds like Pete had the rug pulled out from under him by David and Nancy Feigin. Why would he but so much hard work into this venue just to be pushed out? I'm sure Martyn is not as innocent as sounds. How could he have not have know that the guy that made this place work was being thrown out. If I was going to buy this place the first person I would have talked to was Pete. Just because he bought the walls doesn't mean he bought what makes this establishment special. The sad thing is that the local music scene is going to take the hit. Good luck to you Pete and I hope you find a new venue in the area.